PODCAST TRANSCRIPT
I'm Rachel Strella.
and I'm Vixen Divine.
Well, for today's topic, we're talking
about something I believe that a lot of us
have experienced and may even be
experiencing now.
Burnout.
Yep.
Yep.
Let's dive into activity time.
So Vixen and I took a quiz.
It was for mind tools and it assesses your
burnout level by asking you a series of
questions.
It's really fast, about five minutes.
So we actually don't know the answers to
each other's quiz yet, so this should be
fun.
I also will say that one of the things I
noticed is it will give you a number and a
range of where that like you fall within
that particular like number but I don't
know where I fall in the numbers outside
of my own so we're gonna see if you guys
want to take the quiz and let us know your
number.
Yeah, we don't know if there's a higher or
a lower, like how that works or what the
highest is or what the lowest is.
Yes, yeah, so let's start with our numbers
and how we did.
Vixen, tell me how you fared.
Well, okay, this is what it said to me.
My score was actually 26.
And it said what 26 is, oh, it gave me a
range.
26 is my score, but then I'm within this
range of 19 to 32 is my range.
And that means little sign of burnout here
unless there are some other factors like
that they don't know about.
Okay, okay, so it sounds like on a burnout
scale, it wasn't too bad where you were
at.
Okay.
I have some more room to abuse myself
more.
I have more room to push it.
Okay, well, my score was 43 and my range
was 33 to 49 where it said, be careful,
you may be at risk of burnout,
particularly if several scores are high.
So like several different things within
that.
So we know that there was at least a 49
and I'm a 43 on that scale.
So I don't know if there's like full on
burnout meltdown mode beyond that.
Or if there's even calmer than Vixen, so
if you guys want to take the quiz through
Mind Tools and let us know, I welcome it.
Hey, I wanna meet the person who gets like
a five.
Me too.
I need some tips
Well, inquiring minds want to know while
we're on this really fun topic.
Tell a story of when you felt your most
burnt out.
Oh my gosh, I got one.
It just came like right now, right now.
But, and ladies or aunts sometimes can
relate to this.
I'm a mom.
Honestly, when my kid, and maybe it's more
than most because of my circumstances.
If you guys don't know or haven't watched
the podcast before, both of my kids are
autistic.
And at one point I was a single mom with
two autistic kids.
The burnout, I just, I could have pictured
myself,
in like a street gutter hole just away
from my kids.
It was just like talk about pulling out
like the hair like it was just.
To me, like at that time, it was just
like, it just didn't get any worse.
So for me, the combination of being just a
single mom, you guys know how hard that
would be.
And then you have these special needs
kids.
So you had to have more, oh my gosh.
That was, that was yeah, for me.
Did you find that there were other factors
that compounded that too?
Like your job or, you know, any other
factors that you felt like it wasn't just
the kids, it was like multiple factors.
No, because the job that I had was very
flexible.
Being a nurse was really, really flexible.
So I didn't have the constraint of having
to be somewhere at a certain time, per se,
other than like, cause I worked like the
weekends where you only worked like
Saturday and Sunday or the overnight shift
where the kids were sleeping, like that
kind of, so it was really flexible.
So it wasn't the job.
It was really just, and you got to think
though, mine is back in the day.
So,
We didn't have a lot of resources.
We just kind of figured it out and just,
you just tried not to die.
Well, it's been hard for me to pinpoint
like the most burnout because I can gain
like a handful of times when I've been
really fried.
But one that really comes into focus for
me and it was just basically a perfect
storm, you know, like.
Our biggest client was in like their first
six month renewal and we're trying to get
all of our results together to kind of
prove like, hey, we're ready to do this
and renew our contract.
It was at the end of the year where a lot
of our clients are already coming into new
contract terms and coming up with new
strategies for the next year.
You know, I've had my parents, I was still
kind of dealing with some things there to
take care of them.
And we just, we just had a lot of
different, there was just a lot of
different components that made me feel
just overwhelmed.
And I just call it crashing into the
waves.
I remember writing a blog post about it
because it was 2019.
It was just like, no matter where I
turned, no matter what I did, it was just
one more thing that compounded that pile.
And it didn't get any smaller.
Yeah, yeah, I get it.
Totally get it.
Yep.
Yeah, I mean, you and I have a unique
perspective because we're business owners
and that comes with its own, you know, set
things that can then easily cause burnout.
And I think they're.
it's tough.
It can cause burnout, but at the same
time, because you're a business owner,
don't you feel like you have the power
sometimes to turn it off?
Yes and no.
I mean, I think, you know, when I was
just, when it was just me, I didn't
because that was just me and I needed to
respond or handle it.
But, and especially in a business like
social media where something would come
up, now that it's actually a team of
people, I feel like I have to be there to
support them if there's something that
comes up that they need.
So there's like never really a full escape
from
feeling like I constantly need to be
there.
Okay, alright.
I got it.
It's better now, like with Laney, you
know, she's been amazing.
Hope she's listening.
You know, that was that was huge.
But we're experiencing our own level of
things now we're with the business and
growing and trying to do different things
in that creates another element.
So in any event, you know, let's talk
about
what exactly burnout is.
You know and and actually a friend said to
me today make sure you talk about how it
varies from being tired you know so what
do you think is you know burnout versus
like just you know stress or fatigue.
Well, see, here's the thing about that.
Burnout, actually, when you look at the
definition of burnout, actually within the
definition is fatigue and stress.
So a lot of times, and rightfully so, a
lot of people use the burnout in the same
sentence, in the same way as they do with
stress and fatigue.
So I don't really think that...
There may be minuscule differences, but
really when people say that, they really
just kind of mean the same thing in a
context of words.
I think that burnout to me is a little
more compounded.
Like, I feel like stress or fatigue is
sort of symptomatic.
You know, it's sort of acute and happens
here and there.
But like when you're talking burnout, like
you've like had, you're done.
It's chronic.
You're tired mentally, you know,
physically, emotionally.
And I feel like you're on a rabbit wheel,
like not a rabbit, what do they call it?
Like a hamster, hamster wheel, yeah.
You know, and you're feeling like doing
all these things and you're not getting
any closer to your end goal.
Well, if you think of it that way, then I
would put, I would put it at the end, if
that makes any sense.
Okay, so to be burned out is like the end
of the stress, the end of the fatigue.
Like you've had the stress, like, oh my
God, I had a stressful day.
But then I feel like burnout, you're done.
Like you've had the stress and it's now
done.
Burned out, you're at the end of the road.
I could totally see that and I feel like
sometimes your motivation is just
completely gone.
You're just done, you're fried.
Pull the plug.
But if we can control our stress, which is
really exasperates a lot of our actual
health conditions, we can stop ourselves
from going to fatigue, from going to
burnout.
So I think it could be incremental.
So there's other ways of doing that.
So we'll talk about that in a little bit.
I do agree with you there.
And yeah, that's why I say perfect storm
too.
Because sometimes there'll be like these
things that are happening and you're like,
okay, I can deal with that stress and then
more things keep happening over here and
over here.
And then you're like, okay, now I don't
know how to have I don't have the tools to
deal with all of these things coming at me
at once, you know.
Together.
So we've talked a little bit about the
signs, you know, the symptoms.
I think that tiredness and fatigue and all
of that is a big part of it.
But I think there's also like sometimes
this feeling of hopelessness, you know,
just like beyond measure, how you feel
like you're never gonna come out the other
side, you know.
I agree with you on that.
For burnout, to be done, as we said,
basically, to be done, it is a hopeless
feeling because you don't know how you're
gonna come back from it.
But if you're burned out, that's why I say
you gotta get it early.
You gotta get it early.
So I feel like those stress and fatigues
are signs that you're going in that
direction of burnout.
Yes, yeah.
Yep.
it's the little things in our everyday
lives, even if you don't have like a big
situation, you know, if it's something
that you can't get a handle on, cause some
people handle it.
Everybody has stress, I think.
I haven't met the person yet that doesn't
have stress, but how you handle it, I
think people, some people can go for a
run.
They're good.
Like that's their thing, you know?
So it's how you handle that little bit of
stress
on whether you get to the fatigue and then
you get to the burnout.
Yes, yeah.
I think it shows up physically for you
too.
Like I find if you're feeling like you're
getting sick more often, run down, you
know, and it's just, it's not just one
day, you know, it's starting to compound.
So obviously this is a podcast for women.
How do you think these things manifest
themselves differently with women versus
men?
Well, with women, one thing about women is
we tend to talk.
Most of us talk.
Not everybody, obviously, but, and even if
you, as we talked about introvert,
extrovert, even if you're an introvert,
you talk to somebody, even if it's your
cat.
That's, believe it or not, that is
therapeutic.
To talk to even your cat because it's a
release.
Now your cat's not going to tell anybody.
That's the big difference, but it is a
release.
So to talk about it, to tell someone, that
is a good way of how we tend to talk about
it and how we're going to release it and
how we tend to deal with it.
Men tend to, and I'm generally speaking,
of course, but men tend to shut down.
They tend to, they're figuring it out
almost in their head or they think they
are almost in their head.
And you can kind of see, you can see the
smoke coming up from, you can see the
smoke forming like, okay.
And then the woman will usually say,
what's wrong?
Nothing.
I think men compartmentalize, they're more
kind of impersonal about it.
They just kind of like standoffish,
whatever they'll deal with it.
And I think women, it's more of an
emotional thing and they take comfort
talking to other people about it, and
having a support system.
And that's true.
We do.
We find.
I was talking to my husband about
something about what men talk about.
I'm like, what do you guys even talk
about?
Because, you know, women will walk up to a
woman that we will not know.
Girl, where did you get those shoes?
We truly want to know where she got those
shoes and hope she got them this season.
And where did you get them?
How much did they cost?
And when can are they out of them?
Was it new or they just out?
Like, you ask all these things and
my husband told me guys don't do that.
They don't, no matter if they got the best
suit on, you know, the, the, the tie, the
cufflinks, whatever it is, they, they
don't go up there and they might say, yo
man, that's dope or something, but they
will not ask them like where they got it.
Like they won't be that, you know, unless
they know them.
I do think that comes out of personality
trait too.
You know, like extroverts, introverts.
Like I don't know that I would ask
somebody where they got their shoes, but I
have personalities that would.
But I do say, I will say that when I'm
feeling a certain way, like talking to
somebody makes me feel better.
You know, like a friend, you know, talking
to somebody that I feel like I can confide
in.
Now in this day and age though, is it also
something that you can type about?
Because remember, now there's the texting
and the emailing.
How many times have you wanted to respond
to say a Facebook post?
Because they said something, you type it,
and then you delete it.
Because
Yeah, I'm a total keyboard warrior.
When I'm upset, I will type my response
and walk away just because I have it out
of my brain.
Then I'll come back with a fresh head and
rethink it.
But that's if I'm upset.
I'm thinking more about when I'm upset and
I just want to talk to somebody about it.
Then I'm kind of like, it's a little
different.
It doesn't matter how I do it.
You know, as long as I can talk to
somebody and kind of have them commiserate
with me a little bit.
So the manifesting differently in the men
and women is really about how do they let
it go?
How do they get it out or do that?
yeah.
Yeah.
And I think that men probably keep it to
themselves a lot more than women.
Yes.
Yep.
let's see here.
So, while we're talking about men and
women, do you think there are any specific
gender related factors that contribute to
burnout specifically for women?
Probably, honestly, as culture, even
though we are more diverse now than we
used to be, it is still oftentimes put on
the woman to take care of the kids, to be
the main caretaker, I should say, of the
kids.
Yeah.
They might pick them up from school or
something, but the main caretaker
generally is still the woman, even if she
has a job.
Like they still don't split it.
Do you know what I mean?
So the getting the groceries most of the
time is still her job.
Like there's so many more factors, home
factors besides the work, because now
we're doing the work too.
But we still haven't.
figured out how to split up the home
factors and not feel guilty about it.
Right.
Yeah.
that, and then when you do, you'll ask
them, can you help me with, as opposed to
just splitting it up, you know, okay,
you're in charge of this, I'm in charge of
that.
No, so it's still how that's contributing.
So there's so much more over here.
It's so unbalanced, but you can burn out,
but you feel it's your responsibility.
Yeah, I totally see that.
And I think women take on more of what I
call the niceties.
You know, they send the holiday cards, the
birthday cards, they typically wrap the
gifts and do that shopping, you know, like
all of those other little fluffy things
that just come with a woman's touch.
Oh, um, yes, I'm really lucky because I,
my husband does a lot around the house,
you know, and, and that's really great
that he's so helpful and he runs the
errands and things like that.
But a lot of cases, it's just going to
assume that the women does, they just do
everything they do the housework, they do
the cooking, they do everything.
Yeah, so we're still not, and like I
always say, generally speaking, we're
still not really, we still haven't gotten
that mindset yet that is we need to take
care of, everybody needs to push, pick in,
you know, get a little thing and you do
this, you do that, you know, and I'm
noticing, and you tell me if you've
noticed it, I'm noticing now some
kids aren't even doing chores.
Yeah, I couldn't imagine that.
From growing up, like that was what you
did.
You made your bed, you know, you took the
trash out, you helped your parents, you
know, whatever, you bought groceries in,
like, and now if they do something they
want paid for it, you want a trophy.
I just go, what?
And then they complain and whine.
You know, I just, it just blows my mind.
So that's not that, you know, those things
that used to, even the little things like
loading the dishwasher or washing dishes,
whichever you have, you know, that used to
be a teenager thing or a preteen thing,
you know.
A lot of people are not delegating that
now to the kids because they're too busy.
They have homework.
Well, we all had homework.
You know, it just, so again, so that's
piling back on
to that parent list.
Where those are things, little things like
that can be delegated and taken off the
plate, whereas, but they're not doing that
anymore like they used to.
So again, burnout, too many factors.
Yeah, I agree with you there.
So, you know, you're kind of a specialist
in self care.
So, you know, what are some strategies
that you think could help women sort of
prevent or alleviate burnout?
I have one simple thing that could really,
really help you.
Taking a pause.
That sounds so trivial, so tiny.
I know that.
But honest to goodness, taking a pause can
really, really do a lot for you.
I think I was talking about this earlier.
So this shirt I'm wearing, this shirt, OK,
so it's a cotton shirt.
Wrinkles super, super easily.
You touch it, it's wrinkled, right?
So what I did was, because I'm lazy like
that, I put it in the dryer.
Because that's what I do.
I put it in the dryer for five minutes,
maybe seven.
So while it's in the dryer, also in the
basement is where like my exercise stuff
is.
So while it's in the dryer, I go to the
other side of the basement and I stand on
this thing.
It's a shake, I call it a shaker.
It's a human shaker.
Honestly, goodness, I stand on it, I press
the button and it just shakes me like
this.
So those five to seven minutes really
like,
it gets the oxygen going through you and
everything like, you know, everything's
going through the lymph is everything's
moving.
So you feel alive.
You feel oxygen just those few minutes.
And then, so I got, got my shirt out, went
upstairs and then I stood outside for
literally maybe I did three deep breaths.
I just held it for like a couple of
seconds and let it out.
Breathe that breathe.
That's all I did.
I just took.
Honest, all together, that took less than 10
minutes, less than 10 minutes to do
that.
And you don't have to do that, but just
taking a pause, that will bring you down.
If you are up here, that literally will
bring you down.
And it might not change your day, but
it'll help you start over with your cup
that's boiling over.
I with that.
It's a reset button for a minute.
It's so easy to get caught up in what
we're doing and then, ah, you know, it's
so true.
I'm learning that more and more as I get
older.
Just pause.
I don't have a self -care technique, but I
will say the one thing that helps me when
I'm feeling overwhelmed, there's like,
sometimes you feel like you need to
procrastinate because there's so much, you
just don't know how to start.
You know, I take everything I do that
seems daunting and I break it into smaller
pieces.
That seems super simple, just like you're
taking a pause.
But, you know, I look at, okay, I gotta, I
gotta pay my taxes, you know, and I break
that into five separate steps, you know, I
gotta figure out what they are.
I gotta write the check, you know, I all
that other stuff.
And it's just like, okay, now I have
these, these steps.
It's easier for me to tackle then letting
it sit there on the pile of 10 other
things that I need to do.
I have a calendar too if you know for
breaking stuff up if honest goodness I
because I because I have this that to do
and this other thing and all these other
things to do if it's not written down I
very well may forget to do it not because
I didn't want to do it but because I just
didn't remember and then I'm like oh was I
supposed to do that because I completely
forgot.
You have to write it down.
It doesn't matter how small it is, it will
leave your head in the blink of an eye.
We used Trello for that.
It doesn't matter what it is.
Order contacts.
I write it down right away because I'll
forget and then I'm out of contacts and
then I'm not happy.
You're absolutely right.
You know, burnout is not isolated to just
women like us, you know.
Um, there are celebrities that suffer from
burnout.
You know, one of the things that I
remember probably because it was when I
was younger, um, early two thousands,
Mariah Carey had like a complete mental
and emotional exhausted breakdown.
Um, and I, she went on TRL and she was
just being really goofy, you know, she was
all over the place and you're just like,
what is she on?
You know?
that.
And it was right after that that she she
hospitalized with, you know, exhaustion.
And at that time, I think that record
company she was working with paid her a
lot of money to actually just run.
You know, because it was such a mess.
And there are several other, you know,
celebrities that suffer from burnout and
they're vocal about it, you know, that's
more modern, like Lady Gaga, you know, is
one of them, Selena Gomez.
These are these, you know,
When you're in a career where the pressure
is high, you know, it's really hard to
turn that off.
And I feel like women too, we tend to put
pressure on ourselves, our expectations
for ourselves and what we want to
accomplish.
I just think are generally higher.
That is true.
I will tell you though, there is that I
notably thought was really, I really
commend him for doing this.
Eminem, Eminem guards his peace like it is
like gold.
It is, it is, he, he, I literally am like,
I'm not making this up.
Like even in the industry, only like four
people have his phone number.
You cannot, it's like talking to the
president.
Like you can't just talk to Eminem.
You go through his people and if he wants
to talk to you, like that, that's how that
goes.
He didn't even like, he turned down like
millions of dollars because he did not
want to leave his daughter, you know, when
she was growing up, um, on, you know, on
tour and that sort of thing.
He wouldn't go.
Like he guards his peace like nobody's
business, but he's the only celebrity male
that I've heard of that really takes it to
that level.
That's great advice though, because you
know, an advantage of being accessible is
that, you know, you can get things right
away.
But that's a huge disadvantage too,
because a lot of people will be like,
well, I can just bug Eminem for anything
that I need.
It becomes like a lot of things that they
probably don't need to bother that person
with.
You know, those boundaries are sometimes
really important.
Well, I think also too, if you do that, if
you like, and if you decide, if you're
listening to this and you decide, Hey, I
need to do that or do something like that.
When you do make that call or when you do
send that text, your text or phone call
becomes 10 times more valuable.
Cause they know that if you don't take
this now, they're not calling you back.
True, very true.
I mean, we don't have the advantage of
being a celebrity, but that small tactic
of being unavailable, you know, really
does work.
It's one that I need to do a little more
often.
Well, I tell you what, I think with all
the people that we're talking about, just
even naming those, they are all better off
for it.
Like now in these years past, now they're
better off for it being this way, because
now their careers are still going strong,
they're fine, you know, and they're not
really, at least I don't see that they're
having any problems.
Right, absolutely.
I mean, it just takes a little bit of not
like that fear of missing out type
attitude to be okay with that decision.
do have to be okay with that and fear of
missing out is real.
I get fear of missing out even for a sale.
So I probably can't do that.
I probably can't do that.
Well, we're coming to the end of the
podcast.
Is there anything else that you'd like to
add about this topic?
I just want to emphasize for you to
recognize, even take the test.
Where was the test?
What was the website for that?
Mind tools.
Mindtools.com right?
Okay.
Take the test and see if you're in any
doubt.
Some people they know, they already know,
they're burned out.
But if you have any doubt, just take the
test and see where you are.
And then it will not hurt you to take
those 5 minutes, 10 minutes to pause.
Just try it, just try it, pause and see.
I always say what?
Try it for a week.
If you don't see a difference then stop.
Okay.
you.
Right, give it a try.
I'll say I really like the book
Essentialism and one of the things that he
emphasizes in the book is burnout is not a
badge of honor.
And that speaks to the people that suffer
the most from burnout too are the
perfectionist, the overachievers, the type
A's.
It's not something to be proud of, you
know, so it's so important that you
protect yourself.
Hey, well, thanks for tuning in to the
Light Her Project podcast.
You can follow the conversation online
with our hashtag.
So in the meantime, keep it real, real
women.
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